From fusiblewpa at vossnet.co.uk Wed May 9 23:42:32 2007 From: fusiblewpa at vossnet.co.uk (Simong Andre) Date: Thu Mar 20 20:16:34 2008 Subject: He letterhead Message-ID: <050c01c79303$3aeb83e0$6480d7d0@ybathosu> This one is shoe in to Double by end of week Huge Volume spike, many people are already in the know Birth of Soccer in the US Monolith Athletic Club Inc SYmN- M_N_A_B Extremely b ullish at 1 Cents Pioneers of Soccer Franchising Watch this trade Thursday Add it to your Radar People are already loading up, you should too!! "There were moments of delight and success (this season)," Martin said. championships and we haven't been close to doing either in a lot of ways." ways. But at Michigan, we have a tradition of winning Big Ten and national in a Freedom of Information Act request. Amaker had to be employed as Michigan's ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simong Andre" To: Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 8:27 PM Subject: He letterhead > Birth of Soccer in the US > Monolith Athletic Club Inc > SYmN- M_N_A_B > Extremely b ullish at 1 Cents > Pioneers of Soccer Franchising From buvib at photo-control.com Mon May 14 08:18:35 2007 From: buvib at photo-control.com (Allison XJulius) Date: Thu Mar 20 20:16:34 2008 Subject: But machinery Message-ID: <00a501c79605$3cdd69d0$6592d5a0@qoutstretchedj> This one is shoe in to Double by end of week Huge Volume spike, very low risk and high reward Real Sales and Real Earnings DSI Direct Sales Inc SYm-D-S-D-I Current price : $0.02 Ride this to the top Add it to your Radar Get in before it runs!!! "I want to move as quickly as I can, but some of the coaches we're might be a great deal for us. So we can take that momentum from this game and from the is 46 points against Chicago on Nov. 24 while he was still with the Sixers. He a great deal for us. So we can take that momentum from this game and from the ----- Original Message ----- From: "Allison XJulius" To: , Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 8:27 PM Subject: But machinery > Real Sales and Real Earnings > DSI Direct Sales Inc > SYm-D-S-D-I > Current price : $0.02 > Ride this to the top From robin at alldunn.com Tue May 29 16:41:25 2007 From: robin at alldunn.com (Robin Dunn) Date: Thu Mar 20 20:16:34 2008 Subject: wxPython documentation In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <465CBA25.2030509@alldunn.com> I'm CC'ing this to the wxPython-docs list. I don't know if anybody is still reading that or not, but just in case... Andrea Gavana wrote: > Hi Robin, > > sorry to bother you by writing to you directly, but I was thinking > about the wxPython docs and *if* we can do something to improve them > in some way. I am obviously willing to help, but I need some guidance, > mainly answers on few questions. > My idea was to convert/adapt the wxPython documentation in such a way > to be as close as possible to the official Python docs, and even its > (maybe) future evolution: > > http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2007-May/073232.html > > Obviously is not a one-day work, but if we never start, we never finish :-D > My main concerns are: > > 1) What can we do to improve the docs? Add more docstrings and > examples for every method? Yes. > Wrap and extend (in some way) the existing > html docs? This has been tried before by various people and I've never been fully satisfied with the results. We either had to much C++-isms left in the docs, or had to seriously modify the C++ docs for not much gain. Also it was usually fairly fragile and there were always lots of special cases that had to be dealt with. > Make a "wxPython user guide" similar to the C++ one shipped > with the demo installer? That would be nice to have. > 2) Shall we target newbies and embed part of the Wiki (or create new > small demos) inside this new documentation? Or perhaps have links from the docstring for each item (at least each widget class) to the wiki where more examples, screen-shots, notes, etc. could be maintained by the community. > 3) Is it worth embarking in such effort? Yes, always. I started this page a while back, although I still haven't finished it: http://wiki.wxpython.org/wxPython_Documentation_Project I still need to document how to format the docstrings for the things in the interface files that swig processes, although I just had a thought about how to make that easier for other people to contribute to. (More on that in a moment.) I think that the best thing to do for both the short term and the long term is to make sure that everything that should have a docstring does have one. That will fill out the text for our current documentation solution and will also set us up to be able to take advantage of other standards in the future, because they will surely build upon docstrings. The easiest thing for contributors to work on would be the modules in the wx.lib. There are lots of them that do have docstrings already, but there are some that don't, and lots that are improperly formatted and generate epydoc errors or warnings when the docs are being generated. The part that I haven't documented on that wiki page yet is how to write docs for the items in the .i files so SWIG will create docstrings for them. This is tricky and also more difficult for the contributor because he/she would have to do a lot more work to verify the syntax and also check the output. The idea I just had about this though is that since I will have to closely examine patches for doc contribs to the .i files anyway to make sure they don't break the code generation, that there is another way to do it that will make it easier for the contributor and about the same level of work for me. You (the contributor) can just write the docstrings in your copy of the .py files like normal, test it with epydoc, and then send me a patch. I can then just copy/paste the content of docstrings in the patch into the .i files using the right syntax and then test it with SWIG myself. Make sense? -- Robin Dunn Software Craftsman http://wxPython.org Java give you jitters? Relax with wxPython! From andrea.gavana at gmail.com Thu May 31 12:37:25 2007 From: andrea.gavana at gmail.com (Andrea Gavana) Date: Thu Mar 20 20:16:34 2008 Subject: wxPython documentation In-Reply-To: <465CBA25.2030509@alldunn.com> References: <465CBA25.2030509@alldunn.com> Message-ID: Hi Robin, On 5/30/07, Robin Dunn wrote: > I'm CC'ing this to the wxPython-docs list. I don't know if anybody is > still reading that or not, but just in case... Sorry for the late answer, I was away for work. > > 2) Shall we target newbies and embed part of the Wiki (or create new > > small demos) inside this new documentation? > > Or perhaps have links from the docstring for each item (at least each > widget class) to the wiki where more examples, screen-shots, notes, etc. > could be maintained by the community. Yes, that's a good idea. However, I always thought that having a screenshot for every widget next to the html/chm documentation of that widget would have been nice. I have built an half-functioning automagic thing that runs through (almost) all the wxPython controls and takes screenshots of them (via a wx.MemoryDC, then saving the bitmap). My idea was to run it on all 3 platforms and attach the results in the docs. But maybe is not a good idea. > > 3) Is it worth embarking in such effort? > > Yes, always. I started this page a while back, although I still haven't > finished it: http://wiki.wxpython.org/wxPython_Documentation_Project I > still need to document how to format the docstrings for the things in > the interface files that swig processes, although I just had a thought > about how to make that easier for other people to contribute to. (More > on that in a moment.) Thanks for the link, I didn't know that page existed. > I think that the best thing to do for both the short term and the long > term is to make sure that everything that should have a docstring does > have one. That will fill out the text for our current documentation > solution and will also set us up to be able to take advantage of other > standards in the future, because they will surely build upon docstrings. > The easiest thing for contributors to work on would be the modules in > the wx.lib. There are lots of them that do have docstrings already, but > there are some that don't, and lots that are improperly formatted and > generate epydoc errors or warnings when the docs are being generated. I'll probably start looking at the missing docs (if I find a way to fastly locate them instead of going through all the docs by eyes) and then test it using epydoc. I'll send you the patches as soon as I get something. > The part that I haven't documented on that wiki page yet is how to write > docs for the items in the .i files so SWIG will create docstrings for > them. This is tricky and also more difficult for the contributor > because he/she would have to do a lot more work to verify the syntax and > also check the output. The idea I just had about this though is that > since I will have to closely examine patches for doc contribs to the .i > files anyway to make sure they don't break the code generation, that > there is another way to do it that will make it easier for the > contributor and about the same level of work for me. You (the > contributor) can just write the docstrings in your copy of the .py files > like normal, test it with epydoc, and then send me a patch. I can then > just copy/paste the content of docstrings in the patch into the .i files > using the right syntax and then test it with SWIG myself. Make sense? Yes, it does. I'll be working on this thing starting next week. I hope we'll get a better documentation in the near future. Andrea. "Imagination Is The Only Weapon In The War Against Reality." http://xoomer.virgilio.it/infinity77/ From robin at alldunn.com Thu May 31 13:11:15 2007 From: robin at alldunn.com (Robin Dunn) Date: Thu Mar 20 20:16:34 2008 Subject: [wxPython-docs] Re: wxPython documentation In-Reply-To: References: <465CBA25.2030509@alldunn.com> Message-ID: <465F2BE3.2000802@alldunn.com> Andrea Gavana wrote: >> > 2) Shall we target newbies and embed part of the Wiki (or create new >> > small demos) inside this new documentation? >> >> Or perhaps have links from the docstring for each item (at least each >> widget class) to the wiki where more examples, screen-shots, notes, etc. >> could be maintained by the community. > > Yes, that's a good idea. However, I always thought that having a > screenshot for every widget next to the html/chm documentation of that > widget would have been nice. I have built an half-functioning > automagic thing that runs through (almost) all the wxPython controls > and takes screenshots of them (via a wx.MemoryDC, then saving the > bitmap). My idea was to run it on all 3 platforms and attach the > results in the docs. But maybe is not a good idea. Sounds like a good idea to me, although you need to keep in mind the dual nature of the docstrings. Not only is there the online docs generated by epydoc, but there is the docstring being used in other tools like pydoc and interactive help in the interpreter, popup tooltips in editors like WingIDE, Boa, or in PyShell. In those contexts having a few links to images that wont be displayed by the tool would just be messy and get in the way. But having a "See Also" section with a link to the wiki would probably be okay. On the other hand we might be able to find a way to only use the images when generating the online docs with epydoc, and leave them out of the docstrings otherwise. I've already hacked up epydoc a little for generating the wxPython docs, so one more hack shouldn't be too big of a deal. -- Robin Dunn Software Craftsman http://wxPython.org Java give you jitters? Relax with wxPython!